I agree that using classical formulas is a great idea, and I admire people who stick to those formulas that have been around longest.

On the other hand, I believe the herbalists used those herbs because those were the herbs they had access to and found most useful in their local environment. Had those ancient sages lived in the Pacific Northwest, well they obviously would have done the same classifications with the local herbs here. The principles would not change, and the theory can be applied to any medicinal substance as I mentioned, so why can’t we use the doctrine of signatures and all the symbolism we have learned to get an idea how to use the herbs that grow around us. Many Western herbalists believe the most effective herbs for treating conditions are the ones growing around us.

Plus, quality control and supporting the local economy would be other benefits of either using local herbs or growing Chinese herbs in US. Given what Arnaud has said about the herbs being classified according to the five elements and yin/yang, it makes sense that local herbs could be classified the same way. Plants in North America must follow the same laws and principles of those in China. I think it would be of great benefit to see and understand the plants around us in such a way.

Ideally, I think the best clinical results could be yielded by having a farm near my clinic where I could someday grow, harvest, process my own medicinal herbs for my own practice. Having them fresh, local, therapeutic quality, and with the intention of the practitioner closely instilled in the soul of the plant will most likely yield the best results no matter if you are using Western herbs or Chinese herbs in your practice. That is what my instincts and experience with herbs has me thinking about that subject.

I will let you know how it goes if I ever get it to happen in the future.

The crucial key, in my opinion, is this : you must first understand classical ways of thinking so well that they are second nature. I feel that this would probably take at least a couple decades of dedicated research and self-cultivation. If, then, one feels one can apprehend the principles well enough to classify other substances – by all means, begin experimentation. But, don’t think that a three or four year program and a few years of Qigong qualify one to do what the ancient sages did. Further, I worry about people undertaking something like this “just to do it” or in an effort to be novel. I would only take part in something like this if necessity forced my hand (as referred to in the original article).

Eric

Thank you for the information! It is very disheartening to be reminded how our practice of an ancient art and science with thousands of years of experience using herbs is regulated by Western thinking minds that oversee and govern the laws and scope of practice within Chinese medicine. This is a real issue that reminds me that we must continually make sure we fight for our rights as practitioners of “alternative” medicine. However, we must be prudent as to when and how we voice our opinions to make sure we remain in good standing with these governing organizations. Many of the most difficult issues in practicing classical Chinese medicine in the modern day seem to come down to the interface of Western vs. Chinese way of thinking. Much becomes murky when we try and combine the two, but I think this is even more reason why we must continue to integrate the two medicines and ways of thinking in order to bridge the gap. That is clearly one of the missions of our program at NCNM. While we are a classical program, it could not be more apparent that integration with Western medicine does align with our program considering we have classes called integrative anatomy, physiology, and biochemistry, integrative nutrition, etc. Although, maybe we could argue that these classes were not added because the founder of the program thought we should have them, but because these governing bodies “force” us to have them in order for the school to be accredited. This shows how influenced we really are by the Western mindset as Chinese medicine practitioners. Although, if we are practicing in the Western world, then somehow this makes sense despite the problems that can arise. To me, this means it is imperative that we figure out ways to integrate Western thinking and Eastern thinking in a way that it will become a powerful synergy rather than a roadblock to healing patients.

Yes. That is my understanding. The Department of Health does their best to ignore herbal recommendations but one of my friends spent some time talking to them about the scope of practice. The Department is very divided on how to regulate acupuncturists giving out herbs. Many on the board at this point in time didn’t want us to do it at all. This was about five years ago. The gist was: “Don’t talk about doing herbs. We don’t like to think about that because we don’t read the law the same way you are.”

Given that interpretation, I think Washington would make the argument that even Chinese herbal formulas (the classics) could be considered outside the scope of my practice. I’m not willing to stake my livelihood on a point of theory!

Given that IN THEORY and in writing if not in actual practice, I would argue that you are right. On the other hand, I’m not in practice to make a point but to heal and I really don’t want to loose my license.

There are a number of states who do require that you have both the herbal exam as well as the acupuncture exam. I wouldn’t mind if Washington became one of them. There are a lot of irresponsible practitioners out there and herbs are powerful in ways I don’t think these people appreciate.

And yes, Washington does have one practitioner who is suspended for practicing outside the scope of practice. I have not heard the outcome yet but had to do with our listening portion of the medicine (our side claim) or “counseling” (the DOH claim) and where the line falls. DOH is really trying to push us into being little technicians but I am happy to say that Washington at least has a good lobby.

I would argue it because of the power of the Chinese theory that we CAN step outside the traditionally used Chinese herbs and foods stated in classics and modern Chinese medical books. If we did not have a theory to guide us, well, then it would be hard to try and classify Western herbs, foods, minerals, animals, etc. If we have a strong knowledge of the theory and an understanding as to how the ancient sages who created this medicine thought, I think it should be possible to apply this theory to any medicinal substance- food, herb, gemstone, essential oil, animal, etc. Afterall, I believe yin/yang and five element theory can be applied to any situation or living entity. Therefore, the nature and qi of herbs, which can be also thought of in terms of yin/yang and the five phase movements (elements), should also be able to be classified with this theory. The real problem is trying to figure how to do this while being in alignment with how the ancient sages did this. Assuming we are less cultivated than the sages of ancient China, how do we do this accurately is the question? Books are available on many medicinal substances that attempt to do this, but many are contradictory to one another, or at least not so complete. I think it will just take a couple generations of good doctors working together to compile data and come to a consensus on what is generally accepted as to how these principles apply to the categorizing of medicinal substances found outside the Chinese medicine texts.

So my question for you Bonnie- is it really outside the scope of Chinese medicine if we are still thinking in terms of Chinese theory even though we are talking about a substance not talked about anywhere in the classics? I am under the impression this is perfectly legal, but please let me know if it is not. Is this something that would be regulated depending on the state or country you practice in? I would think having a license gives us permission to think in this way, but please let me know if I am wrong. I would be very saddened to hear that is not legal to do for some chinese medicine practitioners out there somewhere.